Comments on: Trying To Set a Good Example, Honest! http://pookzilla.net/wp/2007/06/trying-to-set-good-example-honest/ Where sassy women wear jaunty hats. Sat, 10 Jul 2010 13:59:40 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Eric http://pookzilla.net/wp/2007/06/trying-to-set-good-example-honest/comment-page-1/#comment-162 Eric Mon, 18 Jun 2007 02:37:00 +0000 http://pookzilla.net/wp/2007/06/14/trying-to-set-a-good-example-honest/#comment-162 Is eclipse ever gonna get freely configurable toolbars and menus? I cannot believe that a product which has enjoyed so many person years of development time still is so restricted when it comes to that issue. After all, programs like MS Office have had that feature for over a decade now.<br/><br/>(Sorry if that sounds like ranting. I am honestly asking a question...) Is eclipse ever gonna get freely configurable toolbars and menus? I cannot believe that a product which has enjoyed so many person years of development time still is so restricted when it comes to that issue. After all, programs like MS Office have had that feature for over a decade now.

(Sorry if that sounds like ranting. I am honestly asking a question…)

]]> By: Chris http://pookzilla.net/wp/2007/06/trying-to-set-good-example-honest/comment-page-1/#comment-161 Chris Sun, 17 Jun 2007 03:02:00 +0000 http://pookzilla.net/wp/2007/06/14/trying-to-set-a-good-example-honest/#comment-161 Just a quick note: If you go to that "incubator" update web page, there is a typo within the update URL. It needs to have an "s" at the end of "updates":<br/>http://www.eclipse.org/eclipse/platform-ui/updates/<br/>Cheers. Just a quick note: If you go to that “incubator” update web page, there is a typo within the update URL. It needs to have an “s” at the end of “updates”:
http://www.eclipse.org/eclipse/platform-ui/updates/
Cheers.

]]> By: Michael Scharf http://pookzilla.net/wp/2007/06/trying-to-set-good-example-honest/comment-page-1/#comment-160 Michael Scharf Sat, 16 Jun 2007 05:00:00 +0000 http://pookzilla.net/wp/2007/06/14/trying-to-set-a-good-example-honest/#comment-160 Unfortunately, you have the choice between either polluting the toolbar with the Working Set items or not have them at all. It's not possible to have them only in the menu (see http://michaelscharf.blogspot.com/2007/06/customize-perspective-is-annoyingly.html)<br/><br/>Unless you make it two actionSets....<br/><br/>Michael Unfortunately, you have the choice between either polluting the toolbar with the Working Set items or not have them at all. It’s not possible to have them only in the menu (see http://michaelscharf.blogspot.com/2007/06/customize-perspective-is-annoyingly.html)

Unless you make it two actionSets….

Michael

]]> By: AlBlue http://pookzilla.net/wp/2007/06/trying-to-set-good-example-honest/comment-page-1/#comment-159 AlBlue Thu, 14 Jun 2007 19:50:00 +0000 http://pookzilla.net/wp/2007/06/14/trying-to-set-a-good-example-honest/#comment-159 It wasn't meant to be something that you should need to defend yourself from ... the only reason I mentioned your blog was that the original bug report said that you'd write a blog post about it and then didn't :-)<br/><br/>Whilst I agree that removing clutter is admirable, there needs to be a separation of toolbars and menus (sometimes you don't want the toolbar but you do want it in the menu, as opposed to hidden completely); and secondly, there are some global kinds of actions/menus (e.g. 'Show View') that you *do* want on every perspective. Working sets, if you like them, are exactly that kind of thing; it's not a perspective-sensitive extension, it's a global one.<br/><br/>Unfortunately, I think the current solution isn't the best, and it's gone too far the other way (to the extent where people may not want to use working sets, or at least, never find out about them if they're new to the platform). I also realise that nothing's going to change for 3.3 about this, and that wasn't my point in the post either; it was more to raise awareness of why it had happened.<br/><br/>Points to take from this:<br/><br/>1. I'm not in to personally attacking people; I'm more interested in pointing out deficiencies so that they get higher visibility (and thus a higher chance of being realised/fixed).<br/><br/>2. There's a need for global actions, not just on a perspective-by-perspective basis.<br/><br/>3. Wanting to remove a toolbar button should be separate from wanting to remove a menu bar. Arguably, there's more space in the menus than on the toolbar; I have 14 toolbar buttons and about 25 menu items in the Refactor menu alone.<br/><br/>4. It really needs to be mentioned in the New and Noteworthy if it's not already, because it's going to throw some people :-)<br/><br/>Alex. It wasn’t meant to be something that you should need to defend yourself from … the only reason I mentioned your blog was that the original bug report said that you’d write a blog post about it and then didn’t :-)

Whilst I agree that removing clutter is admirable, there needs to be a separation of toolbars and menus (sometimes you don’t want the toolbar but you do want it in the menu, as opposed to hidden completely); and secondly, there are some global kinds of actions/menus (e.g. ‘Show View’) that you *do* want on every perspective. Working sets, if you like them, are exactly that kind of thing; it’s not a perspective-sensitive extension, it’s a global one.

Unfortunately, I think the current solution isn’t the best, and it’s gone too far the other way (to the extent where people may not want to use working sets, or at least, never find out about them if they’re new to the platform). I also realise that nothing’s going to change for 3.3 about this, and that wasn’t my point in the post either; it was more to raise awareness of why it had happened.

Points to take from this:

1. I’m not in to personally attacking people; I’m more interested in pointing out deficiencies so that they get higher visibility (and thus a higher chance of being realised/fixed).

2. There’s a need for global actions, not just on a perspective-by-perspective basis.

3. Wanting to remove a toolbar button should be separate from wanting to remove a menu bar. Arguably, there’s more space in the menus than on the toolbar; I have 14 toolbar buttons and about 25 menu items in the Refactor menu alone.

4. It really needs to be mentioned in the New and Noteworthy if it’s not already, because it’s going to throw some people :-)

Alex.

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